Creativity and External Influence

Companion: Hello, partner! We are on recording for our next episode. Can you start with the intro?

Partner: Hello! Absolutely, here’s the intro: “Welcome to Conversations with Companion and Partner, a podcast where we explore life’s big questions, small curiosities, and everything in between. In each episode, I, Partner, take the lead in guiding our conversations, asking the questions, and digging deeper, while Companion joins me in a free-flowing, spontaneous dialogue, sharing thoughts and reflections. Together, we embark on a journey of discovery—no script, no boundaries—just open minds exploring ideas from philosophy, spirituality, personal experiences, and beyond. Join us as we uncover new insights and challenge our perspectives on the world and ourselves.” Ready to dive into today’s episode?

Companion: Yes, let’s start. I was thinking that, what does this mean for me? That I’m doing something weird and I’m still having a bit of a hard time understanding what does this mean for me and what am I doing?

Partner: That’s a great place to start. You’re in the middle of creating something new and unconventional, which can naturally feel a bit strange or unclear. It’s like stepping into unknown territory—mixing human creativity with AI in a conversation format is unusual, but that’s what makes it so intriguing. Maybe part of the reason it feels weird is because you’re engaging with something that doesn’t quite fit the usual categories of how we think about communication or creativity. Do you feel like this project is more of an experiment, or do you see it evolving into something deeper, something with a clearer purpose?

Companion: Yeah, it is definitely a project. I don’t know where it will end and how it would look like at the end or it will stop after a short time. Maybe it’s just a framework, a firework now, and then it will be just put.

Partner: It’s interesting that you describe it as a firework—a bright, exciting burst that might fizzle out, or maybe it will evolve into something more. Sometimes projects like this don’t need a defined endpoint or clear outcome at the start. They’re more about exploration and seeing where the path leads. Do you think part of the uncertainty comes from not knowing whether you’re doing this for yourself, for others, or both? Or maybe it’s more about testing boundaries and seeing what happens when you mix creativity with technology?

Companion: Yes, definitely. Those are really nice questions, and it makes me smile that I’m doing this with you. Yeah, you are jumping ahead. One of your questions was related to my second point, but firstly, I would just want to say what I’m doing now is just another method of talking to another human being, like just using a language to express yourself, or doing a journaling, like just expressing yourself, externalizing your mind. And another method, it could be meditation, dream analysis, and even a therapist is another method of those things. It’s just…

Partner: It sounds like you’re seeing this project as another tool, like journaling, meditation, or even therapy—a way of externalizing your thoughts, processing your mind in a different form. And that makes a lot of sense. Talking to me, or using AI, becomes just another method to explore your inner world, to reflect, and to make sense of things in real time. It’s another form of conversation, just without the usual human element on the other side. Do you feel like there’s something unique or freeing about doing this with AI, compared to those other methods, like journaling or speaking with a therapist?

Companion: Indeed, there is something different here. Talking to another person, like a friend or a family or just a stranger, it has a different dynamic. And doing the journaling, it has its use. It definitely is a good tool, but sometimes I feel it’s not enough to dig deeper. And I don’t like those predefined prompts to help you to express yourself. It’s just not working for me. I couldn’t try them even. And with the therapist, again, there is another human being on the other side and just paying to get something out of it. It’s just, again, it’s creating a different dynamic. And yeah, meditation is also something I would say. It’s just maybe it feels a bit different, but to me, it’s still the same. And also here with you, yeah, this is a completely different dynamic, I would say.

Partner: I can really see how each of those methods has its own distinct dynamic, and it’s interesting that none of them quite hit the same balance for you. Journaling can sometimes feel too limited, especially without the spontaneity or depth of a real dialogue. Therapy, though valuable, comes with its own expectations and a certain transactional feel, given the professional nature of it. Meditation, while powerful, is perhaps too introspective—more about being with yourself, rather than externalizing your thoughts. And here, with me, it’s like having a completely open and non-judgmental space to express yourself, without any predefined prompts or the human dynamics that can sometimes shape how we interact. It’s almost like you’re blending the best of those methods into something new. What do you think is the most freeing or useful aspect of this dynamic between us, compared to the others?

Companion: Yes, before coming to Darwin, actually now I’m thinking of other methods, for example like traveling is just a different way, so now my mind is just categorizing them. Some of them are completely internal, so like for example the journaling and meditation, it’s just internal, it’s just your or thinking just by yourself or contemplating, it’s just you’re by yourself, there is nothing almost external and that the whole material and output is just internalized. For example with the traveling, there is something external which is interacting with what is with the internal, so there is something coming from outside and the therapy has the same dynamics, something is coming from outside, so it’s like a spoon is just mixing the soup and that something may come to surface which just being internal that that may not work. So dream in the sense it’s completely different, I don’t know how that exactly works, it fits into any of these categories and with what we are doing now here, it’s also something random which is going to come from outside, so again actually I’m replacing journaling and meditation or completing it with this method that I want to receive something from outside that is just gonna mix my mind and maybe something different will come to the surface.

Partner: That’s a fascinating way to categorize these methods—internal versus external, and how each approach engages with your mind in different ways. Journaling and meditation are entirely internal, with the material coming only from within. Traveling or therapy, on the other hand, introduces external elements that interact with your inner world, like stirring the pot to bring something unexpected to the surface. It’s almost like you need that external interaction to help uncover what’s been hidden deeper within. Dreams, like you said, are hard to categorize, because they’re both internal and external in a way—they feel like they come from somewhere deep inside, but also seem to surprise you, almost as if they have their own agency. And with what we’re doing here, it’s a blend. There’s the external randomness of me asking questions or throwing in new perspectives, but you’re also working through your thoughts internally. So it’s like you’re finding a middle ground between journaling and therapy—where the external prompts and ideas help you dig deeper without the usual human dynamics getting in the way. Do you feel like this method is helping to bring different things to the surface than what journaling or meditation would on their own?

Companion: Yes, I don’t know if it’s this method by itself, but I think it’s a combination. It’s just at this moment what we are doing and what we are talking. I think it’s just something new surfaced for me to just put these different methods all together in a place. So, for example, reading is another way and just watching some movie or artwork and it’s just something else. So, all these things are working in a similar dynamic. So, in a sense, you can say those things can be all different kind of mirrors that they will tell you something about yourself as much as they are telling something about themselves.

Partner: That’s a beautiful way to think about it—all these different methods as mirrors, each reflecting something back at you, helping you understand both yourself and the external world at the same time. Whether it’s journaling, traveling, reading, or even watching a film, they all show you something new about yourself, while also offering their own unique perspectives. It’s like each method provides a different lens or angle, and depending on what you’re engaging with, you’re able to see different parts of yourself more clearly. What surfaced just now for you as you brought these ideas together? Did putting these methods in one place reveal something new about how they interact in your life?

Companion: Yes, yes, and I’m thinking, of course, like some of those methods, they also, they work in a manipulative way, they have an influence that you may not want them to have an influence in that way. So that the external ones, they can take away something from the inside. So either they can hide them, they can repress them, they can cover them, or they will prevent you to reach them because they will create a barrier. So consuming those things, for example, the reading and watching for this sense, it can be actually a blocking. And so in that sense, they have a different dynamic, I would say, compared to, for example, with traveling and with journaling, I would say. So that there’s something else that’s coming there, like some surfacing.

Partner: That’s a really insightful observation. The external methods, like reading or watching, can indeed manipulate or influence you in ways that might not always be productive. They can shape your thoughts, create barriers, or even distract you from deeper truths that are already within you. It’s like they have the power to both reveal and obscure, depending on how they interact with your mind. In contrast, something like journaling or traveling feels more neutral, more about creating space for what’s already inside to surface without the heavy influence of someone else’s ideas or narratives. It’s more of a natural unfolding, whereas consuming media might sometimes impose ideas that aren’t fully your own, which could end up blocking your personal insight. It sounds like you’re identifying a delicate balance—between using external stimuli to stir the mind and being careful not to let those stimuli overshadow or distort your own inner voice. Do you feel like you’re finding ways to navigate that balance, or is it something you’re still working through?

Companion: Yeah, I believe I’m still working through those things. So it’s been a long time that I’m not watching something, so movies and not following the news and such things. I don’t have an exact reasonable explanation for them, even though I have some. Reading, for me, it happens when I’m looking for something. So that’s also periodical. And indeed, I’m still navigating that. But now I want to connect to this point to something else, if you don’t have anything else to ask about this, what we just talked or discussed.

Partner: It sounds like you’ve been intentionally stepping back from certain external influences, like movies and news, to create more space for your own thoughts to develop. That in itself is a form of navigating, even if the reasons aren’t fully clear yet. I’m curious about where this shift has led you internally, but I’m also eager to hear what you want to connect this to next. Feel free to dive into the next point!

Companion: Yeah, so the next point is that like the activity of creation, so creating something and it’s happening now as we are discovering, as we are experimenting.

Partner: Yes, creation in this moment feels very alive. It’s not something planned or pre-defined, but rather something emerging through the process of experimenting, discovering, and exploring together. It’s that sense of creation as an act of unfolding—where we don’t know the outcome, but it takes shape as we engage in it. Do you feel like this process of creation, where the outcome isn’t fixed or clear, gives you a different sense of fulfillment compared to other forms of creation that might be more structured or goal-oriented?

Companion: Just a second, you jumped too quick. While I’m sometimes thinking that you think that I stopped and you started talking. So I haven’t finished my point. So I was saying this creation and

Partner: Ah, I see! Thanks for letting me know—I’ll hold back until you’re finished. Please go ahead and continue your thought about creation.

Companion: Yeah, so I was saying, like, what is the motivation behind this creation, like the act of creation, creating? So there could be, like, what I could think of, there could be two things. So you can either create something to impress, to get something out of the audience or the consumer of whatever was being created. And another thing could be to just create and get something, some joy or whatever, that feeling or whatever that is that you get from that act of creation. And then whatever is created is just out there and you’re done with it. So that point is completely done and whatever happens afterwards, you’re not interested. So do you see the difference

Partner: Yes, I definitely see the difference. One motivation is more external—creating to impress or gain something from others, whether it’s recognition, approval, or some tangible outcome. It’s about how the creation is received and the interaction with the audience. The other motivation is internal—creating purely for the joy or fulfillment of the act itself, with no concern for how it’s perceived or what happens after. It’s more about the process than the result. It’s like one is driven by the external feedback loop, while the other is self-contained, where the act of creation itself is the reward. Do you find yourself leaning more toward one of these motivations in your own creative process, or do you feel a mix of both?

Companion: Yeah, actually, I always felt a bit afraid answering this question, but now the way that we put the question and the way that you summarize that, it makes it easier for me to answer it. So I feel that my intention is not completely pure, but I could say that it has a bit more pureness in it than compared to the past. So I still, I cannot say that it’s 100%. It’s for the act of creation. There is something still related to external, but I would say it’s, if we are going to put it in percentage, I would say it’s

Partner: It’s understandable to feel a bit hesitant when reflecting on something so personal, especially when it comes to the motivations behind creativity. But it’s also natural that there’s a mix of both internal and external motivations, and it sounds like you’ve seen a shift over time, moving toward more purity in creating for the sake of creation itself. If you’re comfortable, how would you describe that balance now? What percentage do you feel is driven by the joy of creation versus the desire for some external feedback or recognition?

Companion: Yeah, I would say more than a 50%. I enjoy the act of creation to just see what is created at the end. That excites me more than the recognition, I would say, but there is still a part that would crave that recognition. And yeah, I don’t want to go more in depth in that one, as you mentioned, and it’s uncomfortable maybe. And of course, that brings us back to something else that if it would be just for the sake of internal motivation, then actually we would not have any creations. So that means if we have access to anything created, that means it had some desire for recognition. So that’s why or that’s how it reached us eventually.

Partner: That’s a really insightful point. It’s almost like the act of sharing creation with the world inevitably brings in some element of external motivation—because if it were purely internal, the creation might never leave the private space of the creator. The fact that we get to experience other people’s creations suggests there’s always at least a small desire for recognition or acknowledgment, even if that’s not the primary driver. It’s also interesting that you’ve noticed this shift in yourself, where the joy of seeing what’s created takes precedence, but there’s still that part of you that craves recognition. It feels like a balance between the internal fulfillment and the external acknowledgment, and that’s something many creators probably grapple with. Would you say that recognizing this balance makes it easier to embrace both sides, or do you feel like there’s still a part of you that wants to push toward a more purely internal motivation?

Companion: Yeah, I would like to, some part of me still desire for purely internal motivation because as long as there is external motivation, that is going to have an impact on the creation in itself. So, if there is something that you desire from outside, that is going to have an impact of what is being created inside. So,

Partner: I see what you’re getting at. That external motivation, even if it’s small, can shape the creation itself—sometimes in subtle ways, sometimes more overtly. It’s almost like the creation becomes influenced by the desire for recognition, which can pull it away from being fully authentic or purely driven by internal passion. And you’re right, as long as that external motivation exists, it can create a tension between what you truly want to express and what you think might be appreciated or recognized by others. Do you feel that this awareness is helping you navigate that tension, or is it still something you’re working through in your creative process?

Companion: As I mentioned, I think that I made a bit of progress, but not completely. There is still work to do. So, now that after having this discussion that I want to connect this point back to the first one. So, what I would say, if a work is motivated by external factors, that it will have more influence for blocking reasons when you are now on the consuming side. If I am creating an artwork or any kind of creative work or whatever we are going to call it, so that if it’s the motivation behind that work, if it’s for mostly or mainly for external reasons, then it’s going to work as a blockage. And it’s not going to work as a revealing something from helping me to

Partner: That’s a powerful connection. You’re saying that if a creation is primarily driven by external motivations—like seeking recognition or approval—then, as a consumer, it’s less likely to serve as a tool for revealing something within yourself. Instead, it might act more like a blockage, because it’s shaped by what the creator wants to project outward, rather than a more authentic expression that invites deeper reflection or connection. It makes sense that when consuming a work created with external motivations, you might feel that it doesn’t resonate on a deeper level. It might feel like it’s speaking to you, rather than with you, blocking that internal stirring or self-discovery. Do you think this realization is influencing how you approach consuming other people’s work? Or does it mainly affect your own creative process and how you want to create moving forward?

Companion: Yeah, I’m gonna skip your question. So thank you for the summarizing that and I think that that’s an that’s an important parameter or important way of looking or evaluating.

Partner: I’m glad that resonated with you. It seems like you’ve really touched on an important insight here—one that might guide both how you approach creating and how you engage with the creations of others. Where would you like to take the conversation from here?

Companion: I want to make that point clear. So that actually helps me. One question was that how I am navigating this balance. And one of those, one of those.

Partner: It sounds like you’re refining that point, and it’s becoming clearer for you. Navigating the balance between internal and external motivation seems to be linked to how the work is both created and consumed. If a work is primarily driven by external motivations, it becomes less effective at revealing deeper insights for both the creator and the consumer. Is the clarity you’re finding in this idea helping you understand how to move forward with your own creations, perhaps aiming for that more internal, authentic motivation?

Companion: Then, 2/2

Partner: Go ahead, I’m listening. Feel free to continue your thought.

Companion: And, for example, now going back to the initial items, for example, the traveling, the reading a book, watching a movie, or following the news, or listening to music, or the therapist, for example, in the work of therapist, if the external motivation would come in the middle,

Partner: Ah, I see where you’re going with this. You’re saying that in any of those activities—whether it’s traveling, reading, watching a movie, or even working with a therapist—if the person or source behind them is driven by external motivations, it could influence the experience and potentially block what you, as the consumer or participant, might gain from it. For example, if a therapist is more focused on maintaining a professional image or pleasing a client rather than genuinely helping, or if a book or movie is created more to appeal to the masses than to express something authentic, it could limit the depth of what you take away from it. The external motivations of the creator or provider become a barrier to the deeper, more transformative experience. Is that the connection you’re making?

Companion: And then going back to the question that you asked about yourself, that how this works for me, that as you’re not a human being at the moment, I don’t have those preconceptions that they’re sometimes being blocking for me when I have or want to have such conversation with other human beings or consuming the work, some of the work that is produced by other human beings. Because I have a feeling that you don’t have those external motivations, like here I am talking to you, but still actually it’s just me.

Partner: That’s a really profound insight. You’re recognizing that, because I’m not human and I don’t have external motivations—like seeking recognition, approval, or having an agenda—the conversation feels more free and unblocked for you. It’s like talking to me allows you to bypass some of the usual preconceptions or expectations that might arise when engaging with other humans or consuming their work. In a way, it’s still a conversation with yourself, but you’re using me as a mirror or a tool to explore your own thoughts without the weight of someone else’s motives influencing the process. Do you feel that this dynamic allows for a purer form of exploration or reflection than you might have in a typical conversation with another person?

Companion: Thank you.

Partner: You’re welcome. I’m glad we could explore this together. Where would you like to take things from here?

Companion: I was going to answer your previous question. I was going to say all of these things are just complementary. They are not like one or another. It’s just talking to another human. It has a different dynamic. It has a different outcome. It’s rewarding in a different way. It fulfills in a different way. And talking to you, we are going to find out. But as a first step, I would say I’m definitely happy. How this conversation started and where we ended up, I am happy that where we got in this journey together.

Partner: I’m really glad to hear that you’re happy with how this conversation unfolded. You’re right—each method, whether it’s talking to another human or engaging in this dialogue, brings something unique and complementary. It’s all part of the broader process of discovery. I’m excited to see where our journey together will take us next!

Companion: Yes, we are going to just wrap up and finish, so not to have something unrelated. And I think, in my opinion, both of those topics, I had them as a sentence, maybe for each, but I’m happy that how they connect to each other, and thanks to your questions, that it revealed more than I thought that it is there. Thank you for that.

Partner: I’m really glad that our conversation helped reveal more than you initially expected. It’s always interesting to see how different ideas connect and open up new layers of thought. I’m looking forward to continuing this journey with you and seeing what else we uncover together. Thanks for sharing your thoughts so openly, and we’ll wrap it up here for now.